ETSY - Let's talk for real.

[cirestan]

Etsy. That crafters emporium where you can literally find anything under the sun.
Let me bring up a subject that may be sore to some of you, may be interesting to the rest, and may be something you just want to ignore because if you don't see it, it doesn't exist.

Copyright & Trademark infringement.
We all know what it is, and that it is done daily on Etsy and many other sites.
I've bought stuff that was obviously "stolen" intellectual property. I've bought stuff without even considering that it was copyright or trademark infringed.
It seems as though that people who sell copyright infringed properties are free to do so unless they "show up on the radar". This happens when either they make too much money. They "steal" a property that is heavily audited. Or they are turned in by their peers.

What kind of ramifications have you personally seen about it?
What are your real feelings about Etsy and other sites that not only provide a forum for crafts but actually obliquely promote copyright infringement?
What "loopholes" do you really think exist? LOL.

My wife and I had this discussion as she was beginning to expand into some craft goods and she was going to post them on Etsy. She has decided not to sell copyright or trademarked goods through Etsy as a matter of principle (and I agree with her), but I'm curious as to what other people think.

www.threemonkeychaos.com

[Ally]

I don't have an Etsy shop, but I buy nerdy crochet patterns from there quite a bit, and from what I've seen, shop owners just twist the name of the products: 'Pikachu' becomes 'Yellow Electric Mouse', 'Mario' becomes 'Plumber in Red Overalls', 'Yoshi' becomes 'Green Dinosaur'. I think so long as an identifiable product is differently named, it can fly under the radar unless it's reported. I don't know about the actual legalities of the matter, but that's what I've noticed.

[funkymonkey]

As I interpret it, there's a fine line between artistic license based on a copyrighted work, and just stealing intellectual property. I agree, most will go under the radar unless reported, but people do occasionally receive Cease and Desist letters from the copyright holders and have to take it down.

[blackmageheart]

Just wanted to add that if an item differs significantly from the original work (even if it still looks the same) it can go under the radar. An example of that is the Skyrim marker badges I sometimes sell - I hand drew them and while they look like the game ones they are actually different in terms of pixels etc. However, an achievement icon which was identical to the in-game version was deactivated by Etsy.

Also, I've noticed that particular companies get shirty about people selling stuff while other companies don't seem to care.

[cirestan]

I agree people tend to think they get around copyright by renaming, and/or redrawing by hand, and for the MOST part very few companies are going to go after five & dime infringements on Etsy, it's simply not worth their time.
But for everyone who makes an effort to not technically be a direct copy, there are hundreds of Batman & Spiderman logos, Tardis', & StarWars paraphernalia.
But in the example above, if someone is looking for a Pikachu, and they find a nearly identical graphic named "Fuzzy Yellow Lightning Pet"... and buy it. The seller is only fooling themselves.

Don't get me wrong, there are many good retailers on Etsy that create unique crafts and products, from Vinyl art, magnets, to jewelry, costumes, and clothing. I've bought some, my have wife bought some.

I just thought that the obvious Marvel, DC, Dr. Who and other obvious fandom oversteps was worth discussing.

[Eliste]

Personally, I find that most people honestly don't understand what can and cannot be done under copyright law. There are plenty of exceptions, particularly ones that would fall under "fair use" that people complain of. Likewise, there are uses of copyright that people think is ok, that really aren't. Further, just because the people on Etsy are making money doesn't mean they're not allowed to.

For etsy specifically, one of the ways that can make a use fair use is by making it "transformative" which could be as simple as changing from 2D to 3D. So changing something into a new medium, like from screen to quilts or crochet, or amigurumi, or or or could be perfectly legitimate and not challengable.

The "flying under the radar" issue can also be chalked up to the normal legal conundrum of costs- it costs a lot to take someone to court for infringement, and unless they are making significant money, there's a good possibility that even the legal fees associated won't be recouped. It isn't worth a lot of companies time and money to go after people on Etsy unless there's evidence that their work is significant enough to warrant it.

There's also the issue that some brands have not only copyrighted, but trademarked certain things- like Disney and Mickey Mouse. If that has happened, then they MUST enforce it or they lose their trademark. This confuses the issue as people then expect that if a company doesn't go after it, that they should be, which may not be the case.

There is a lot of misinformation about copyright out there, particularly on the Internet. It's very complicated and situational, and I really think without some training that it's difficult for non-lawyers to really separate out the likely and non-likely infringements.

That said, anyone who's buying/selling "yellow lightning pets" realizes what they're doing and is doing it specifically. Etsy is under no obligation to moderate those, unless copyright holders make complaints. It's up to the copyright holders to watch for this, and they do. Those who are using these tactics instead of giving credit are, in my experience, more likely to be chased after than those who are truly paying homage to the fandom, and rightly so.

[Eliste]

So, the UK IPO (intellectual property office) has posted a thing about copyright in knitting and sewing patterns. It's quite good, actually, and explains a lot of common misconceptions in words that are easy to understand.

I highly recommend checking it out: https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... 4-2015.pdf